Tuesday, June 2, 2009

Where's Zeddmore?

Unique Fixer-Upper Oppurtunity

Art – I like the overall atmosphere of the strip as from the opening shot of the building, to the background, and even foreground drawing in front of Robbie in panel 3 help show that the place is a dump. This is a lot better then just taking the word of Max and having bland backgrounds.

Also, the shading is done well here as it matches the darkness of the building and what little light casting the shadow. However, this shading makes my point about the usual shading, the differences of shading between those strips in “light” and “dark” is minimal at best.

All the characters look good as well, but I have a question, does Jase ever move? I know one strip is not a big deal but if you look here, here, and here it looks like his major motions are facial expression and slight upper body movement.

Story – I like the story so far just for the mere fact that Cole, Brent, Francis, Jade, and Skull (even though I like Skull a lot) are not involved. I don’t necessarily hate stories with the above characters involved, but you get fatigued from seeing the same 3-4 characters over and over again, especially if there is a larger cast of characters behind them as well.

The story line has a lot of ground to cover to see if anything comes of it, but it is a nice change of pace and I’m interested in seeing the next day’s strip just to see the interaction between the three.


TheOriginalJes said...

Zeddmore comes later. He gets hired after the business takes off.

Melnitz is the one to see next.

(Watched it on AMC last night.)

TheOriginalJes said...

Burnt Toast -

Ok, the agent was on Max's bluetooth. That makes sense. Too bad he isn't wearing it in yesterday's strip, though.

I liked the punchline about domestic beer. Of course, I hope he realizes that his micro-brew will also be domestic. :)

I hope Scott is going to do some great work with the new background scenes he'll have to do if this place becomes a permanent hang for the PVP crew. (Not that the office is greatly flushed out.) It would be nice to see some fine detail work on the heals of seeing it as a crap-hole.

But, what is that architectural detail under the window behind Robbie and Jase? Is that the rear of the building? Lot's of nit-picking potential there. But, Scott isn't an architect/city planner, so I'll take the asshat off now.

I'd say today's strip (story-wise) is good in that it allows for Scott to pick up or leave off as he chooses, without breaking the flow with some one-offs.

TheOriginalJes said...

Bullshit alert - The following is non-constructive and unrelated to PVP or PVPMMS. Yet, I still feel compelled to bring it up. Proceed at your own care...

I just spent some time at the last Ding! reading some comments. I didn't realize that it finally has become Ding!MakesMeSad. It's certainly a change from all of the blind support from the first several strips posted there.

But, I'm left to wonder...

We all knew Ding! was temporary from the start. So, if Ding! has come to an end (with the fiscal quarter of it's last post), shouldn't CrispyGamer let everyone know?

It's a dead strip getting plenty of hits and new comments everyday. Is that how they get most of their traffic?

I've just made sure to update my bookmarks to avoid Ding!. Hopefully, others will follow suite. Just to see what happens over there.

Jai said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Jai said...

People like Kurtz are why "Hear, hear" is being out-used on Google by the incorrect and slightly baffling "here, here".

Burnt Toast had a decent punchline, except that the words don't indicate that Robbie is actually displeased with the domestic he's drinking. His expression seems to indicate mild displeasure... except that it's EXACTLY THE SAME expression that is being used in the preceding three panels, where presumably Robbie is not displeased.

And so, we have here a strip that appears to be entirely unaware of the punchline it contains. Poor craftsmanship.

A Nonny Mouse said...

When I was a kid I used to think it was "hear here." I wish I was right, because I still think it's the best possibility.

TheOriginalJes said...

@Jai -

Good catch. I didn't even consider his facial expression.

Looking back, he seems just a annoyed in all the panels in this strip.

rdy said...

@Jai : The expressions in the strip are terrible. I mean, what is it with Jase looking pissed at Robbie in the first panel? And Robbie is unphased by the news that his dreams are going ahead in the first two.

Worse still, despite the first two Robbie's looking like copy/pastes, they're two different drawings. Given he'd drawn him twice, why on Earth didn't SK give one of them a more appropriate or at least different expression. Is he just tracing all his characters from reference now? It'd certainly explain Jase's out-of-place scowl.

rdy said...

@TheOriginalJes: According to his twitter (and if you read the Ding comments, you probably know this already as it's how I found out), SK said "more ding is coming. Expect post about it Friday."

Dunno what this means as he's promised... and failed to deliver more than enough times in the past that I don't bother getting my hopes up. Like people in the thread keep saying though, why does he post these snippets on twitter rather than in the Ding comments (or even on PvP) where he'd be reaching the people who'd actually like to know.

That said, I guess I can understand why he wouldn't want to face the Ding crowd given how much he's messed them around.

TheOriginalJes said...

@rdy - Thanks for the info.

Actually, I started to skim the Ding comments after the latest 25, or so, as of yesterday. I was more impressed with the general tone of the crowd, as compared to when Ding was new.

A Nonny Mouse said...

"Worse still, despite the first two Robbie's looking like copy/pastes, they're two different drawings."

I remember being surprised four or five years ago to read that he wasn't just copying and pasting the characters from a selection of pre-drawn clip art. I guess only looking that way some of the time is an improvement of some sort.

rdy said...

It's like Jase in yesterday's strip. He's been drawn in that pose/expression all week and for that panel, it just looks completely at odds with what is been said and who you'd be focussing on.

I guess when he's rushing, SK falls into some bad habits.

R.W.McGee said...

I think he's still using templates for his characters, he's just using them more as a reference/tracing guide than a copy/paste situation.

It's rarely his art that bothers me, and almost always the lack of an interesting storyline...but in 'Burnt Toast' where he does a perspective flip in the first two panels, there are at least three problems with the new arrangement of people/items. (hints: door, proximity of Max to Jase and Robbie, Max's eyebrow)

rdy said...

The storylines have never really done anything for me and I've come to expect a rather pedestrian effort on that front. The number of lazy "I hope the 'unexpected' doesn't happen... oh, it has!"-type storylines has skyrocketed recently and even though we haven't had one lately, I'm sure everyone remembers those terminally dull arcs that even SK got bored of and drops without a satisfactory ending.

But the artwork is also showing signs of stagnation. The number of copy/pastes, 'safe' traces and the ever-present mailslot mouths (the facial expression that apparently fits *every* situation in SKs book) has crept up.

kurtz said...

R.W. The only thing you're good at is looking just a dumb bass fishing yokel.

TheOriginalJes said...

As this is the first open post on the board, I'll use it. Sage, would you please re-post this if you don't find it too offensive?

@ Sage - I knew that the other post was about slow pour. That's the one I meant to respond to. The previous day's post has a very long critique (which from me, is admittedly [and stated therein {kurtz}] harsh). In fact, it seems to have set someone off.

@ kurtz - say what you will about my life. I am a fan of PVP. I AM an asshole. I have fun sharing with and learning from the core group at PVPMMS.

Artist who cannot tolerate feedback shouldn't open themselves up to interaction with the fans. The best ones don't.

Also, an artist shouldn't claim to welcome negative feedback, then pitch hissies when it comes.

Go back to the earlier posts of PVPMMS, and anyone will find that I was one of the first to defend tardiness and imperfections in a FREE product. I still try, in most cases to limit my comments to likes and dislikes. I also try to limit those comments to a community which the offended party has repeatedly claimed to refuse to revisit.

You will also find an open declaration stating exactly what upset me, personally, from Scott Kurtz. But, I remained a fan.

What you won't find, are responses from the author to any reasonable critique of the comic known as PVP.

But, you will find schoolyard comebacks and intentionally mis-directing comments, which even the fan-boy's stopped supporting.

If you want to disagree with a comment, let's debate the issue. But, do refrain from openers like "Why don't you like me?", or "What did I ever do to you?" The regulars here have worked very hard to weed out the more immature element of blog commenting. (I won't name names so as not to be inflammatory.)

Just remember, every time you blog about your likes and dislikes about another comic, movie, music, tv series, or game; you do exactly what many of us here do.

Scott said...

say what you want to justify the bile you spit here. It's beyond feedback. I get feedback all the time. I like feedback. This is more than that.

And Brett, I read your big post explaining why I'm suddenly active on this site. For you to compare me responding to critics and blasting them to what you do here is ludicrous.

When a girl tells me that her critique of my work is as important if not more important than my internal voice, I'm gonna respond to that. That calls for a blast-back.

It's not the same as fabricating a site designed to spit bile at someone.

And you can claim all you want that you spend an fragment of your life here and thinking about PvP, but the site itself is a testament to that NOT being the case. You can't claim this site is such an afterthought in your life and in the same breath tell me how important this community is to you.

Scott said...

"Just remember, every time you blog about your likes and dislikes about another comic, movie, music, tv series, or game; you do exactly what many of us here do."

That is SO not a fair comparison. When I post my reviews/likes/dislikes about the comics, movies and music I consume, it's just an opinion.

I'm not focusing on ONE product and author and seeking out daily reasons to tear them down and point out how horrible they are.

TheOriginalJes said...


Thank you for coming. Please be patient with me now, as I am at work.

I'd like to know specifically which other previous comments I made are unfair, and why do you feel that way. By this I mean, let's nit-pick my (and only my) comments so that you can inform me as to where I've crossed the line. I may be stubborn at times. But, if I'm wrong, show me and I won't do "that" again.

TheOriginalJes said...

"That is SO not a fair comparison. When I post my reviews/likes/dislikes about the comics, movies and music I consume, it's just an opinion."

How am I not just stating an opinion?

TheOriginalJes said...


I just realized that what I asked might sound like I want you to do a butt-load of research. Let me just give you an example of what I mean.

Here's one that I found with a Google search for "TheOriginalJes PVP".


If you could just find something for me to link to. That would be really helpful. Thanks.

TheOriginalJes said...

And I got 177 hits for "TheOriginalJes pvpmakesmesad"

kurtz said...

Jes, if you're one of the more reasonable posters here, I apologize for generalizing. But from my perspective, all the names tend to blur together here for me.

I don't stop to see individually who's writing what. I just skim the comments and see negativity and hyper-analyzing on an unbelievable scale.

It's nice to go back and pick yours out and see a lot of "I wish he would this or I like but would have preferred, etc." instead of "wow. dumb again. Poor craftsmanship. Just pedestrian. Why bother? blah blah I'm too good for PVP but I read and hyper-scrutinize it daily."

Which is 90% of this entire site and it's commenters.

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